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c | MARINE REVIEW. DETROIT MEETING OF LAKE SHIPPING INTERESTS. Little Progress Made Toward the Organization of an Asso- ciation for Inspection and Classification--A Lack of Interest Among Vessel Owners. Editorial Correspondence. Derrort, Mich., Dec. 15.--At the meeting of vessel owners, ship builders and general agents of the underwriters doing business on the lakes, held here on Thursday, Friday and Saturday of last week, little progress was made to- ward the formation of a general association for the ivspection and classifica- tion of lake yessels, which now seems to be the only hope entertained by the general agents for a readjustment of the numerous questions growing out of the loss of two large steel steamers on the lakes during the past season. It was not intended, of course, that at this preliminary meeting the insurance men would do anything more than secure from builders, owners and experts all possible information regarding the present practice in construction of steel vessels. In this they were partially successful, and they spent a great deal of time in discussing such information as they had received, but there was a nota- ble lack of interest in the meeting among vessel owners, and it is doubtful if they can be induced to takeany part in the publication of the proposed im- proved and revised Inland Lloyds Register, which the insurance men con- cluded, after their deliberations, would cost for the first year about $11,000. At the first meeting Thursday the following representatives of the differ- ent general agencies were present: Capt. David Vance, David Vance & Co., Milwaukee; George L. McCurdy, agent Insurance Company of North America Chicago; C. W. Elphicke, C. W. Elphicke & Co., Chicago; S. Warner White, Michigan Fire and Marine Insurance Company, Detroit; J.S. Gadsen, Aitna Insurance Company, Chicago; H. 8. Sill, Worthington & Sill, Buffalo; C. A. Macdonald, Crosby & Macdonald, Chicago; W. J. Sandrock, Smith, Davis & Co., Buffalo; P. H. Fleming, P. H. Fleming & Co., Chicago; J. J. Clarke, Detroit Fire and Marine Insurance Company, Detroit. The ship builders were represented at the evening session on Friday by F. W. Wheeler of F. W. Wheeler & Co., West Bay City; Frank E. Kirby of the Detroit Dry Dock Company, and Messrs. Henry D. Coffinberry and A. Angstrom of the Cleveland Ship Building Company. W. I. Babcock of the Chicago Ship Building Company and Edward Gaskin of the Union Dry Dock Company, Buffalo, sent letters agreeing to abide by the decision of other build- ers in any agreement they might make as to the part to be taken by the build- ers in the preparation of rules or in bearing a part of the expense of inspec- tion and classification. The only vessel owners present at any of the meetings were M. A. Bradley and James Corrigan of Cleveland and W. A. Livingstone of Detroit. When asked as to whether the vessel owners would bear a part of the expense of inspection and classification, these gentlemen informed the un- derwriters that they were in attendance simply as individuals and could not speak for owners in generel. Mr. Bradley, as president of the Lake Carriers' Association, had received an invitation from Mr. Vance to send a committee to the meeting, but it was decided that according to its constitution, and in view of varied interests involved in the association, that body could take no part in insurance matters. This ended the talk with owners and Messrs. Bradley and Corrigan returned to Cleveland without having accomplished anything more than an informal talk with the underwriters. To the steel builders, who were nearly all represented at the session on Fri- day, the underwriters outlined their plans for the publication of a new register and asked for suggestions as to the best men available for the preparation ofa set of rules and for conducting the inspection service. The builders were asked to consider the question of preparing rules themselves, but they were all of the opinion that the task was not only a difficult one, but was algo labor- ious and would require more time than any of them could spare from their regular employment. All of them promised, however, to give assistance to anyone who might be delegated to the work, and they also promised to bear a portion of the expense of publishing the new register, in event of an under- standing being reached between owners, underwriters and builders. Mr. George F. Williams, who was until a short time ago superintendent at the ship yard of F. W. Wheeler & Co., was mentioned in connection with the office of surveyor, with the understanding, of course, that in the preparation of rules the assistance of one or more naval architects, not connected with any of the lake yards but having some knowledge of the practice here, should be called in. With the conclusion of an informal talk along this line, the builders, who had been in consultation with the underwriters for only a couple of hours, left for their homes, and after a short evening session Messrs. David Vance of Milwaukee, J. J. Clarke of Detroit and W. J. Sandrock of Buffalo were ap- pointed a committee to take further action regarding the detail of securing funds and officers for the establishment and maintenance of a new register. This committee was appointed with a view to overcoming the delays attendant upon work of this kind when performed by a large body, and the general agents will be called together again by Mr. Vance as soon as there is océasion for another general meeting. Messrs. HK. Platt Stratton, chief engineer surveyor for the American Ship- masters' Association, and Capt. F. D. Herriman, American lake representative of the Bureau Veritas of France, were also at the Russell house during the greater part of the time while the underwriters were in session, and informa- tion was sought of them relative to comparisons between the rules of their as- sociations and the practice that has prevailed in the building of steel vessels on the lakes. ; se It can be said in truth that the agents of lake underwriters were very much disappointed in the apparent refusal of owners to take any interest in this first meeting. Their disappointment will be increased upon learning that managers of the Lake Carriers' Association at a meeting in Cleveland on Mon- day of this week, refused to enter into any agreement to pay a portion of $11,- 000 estimated as the first cost of establishing the proposed new register. It is the general opinion among owners, and especially the great number of them who own no steel vessels, that they are under no obligations to the underwri- ters, who have burdened them with heavy rates of. insurance, while reaching out for a line of risks on steel boats, with which they have now been bitten. Unfortunately it is still probable that the owners of the medium and poorer grades of boats will be made to suffer as a result of the present disturbance in insurance matters. Accidents to steel vessels during the past season have sim- ply resulted in directing the attention of the Bureau Veritas, American Ship- masters' Association and other leading classification associations to the lakes, and it is the coming of representatives of these organizations that the general agents on the lakes fear more than the withdrawal of their own companies on account of the accidents referred to. The demand for improved construction is imperative upon owners and builders and is already being complied with in vessels now being built. These new steel vessels will find insurance at Lloyds more readily than ever before, on account of the classification to be given them by registers which cover the whole world, and the general agents of the lakes also have in view, on this account, the danger of making their rules for the proposed new Inland Lloyds too rigid. Their system of main- taining expensive head offices, general and local agents, and otherwise divid- : ing commissions is, it seems, too expensive to permit of their continuing in con- trol of the risks on steel vessels, when the movement toward classification in the big registers seems inevitable. It is the opinion of some vessel owners who have given attention to the different questions arising from this discussion of insurance matters that a stock company for inspection purposes, which would be entirely independent of all interests, might accomplish more than is now expected from the present movement among the underwriters. Unless the drift-of opinion is misleading the outcome of the Detroit meeting will not be important, and insurance matters will go on next spring without much sys- tem, as they have for several seasons past. In any event owners of the large number of wooden boats, who have borne the brunt of high rates in the past, can expect little relief, unless it is through the possibility of being driven to mutual insurance in the future. But the same diversity of interests now acting against the establishment of a new Inland Lloyds Register are obstacles to mutual insurance. The losses of the past sea- son go to prove, however, more forcibly than ever before the truth of the ar- gument that the most profitable insurance is in these vessels of the medium classes. The following table bearing upon this argument shows the total losses of the past season, exclusive of collisions, which cannot, of course, be taken into consideration : Statement of vessels given up as total losses from all causes ex- cepting collision, season of 1892. : American. Canadian. Total. No.| Value. ||/No.| Value. No.| Value. ARGS sete ess eee oe ees: 27 = DADO; OO AER s salaececeeereee 2 | $420,000 RTE AEG eo eae ge ce el peak pet BG cease aera ie MRO ce ee ee eee ee | ol Crete et ee eee ete 10 116,500 5 | 67,000 || 15 183,500 A23 Bar nee ee omen a ote 6 56,000 2 | 24 ,000 8 80,000 1 See oc Ae oe roe OS 10 39,800 4 | 19,500 || 14 | 59,300 Bide tare cc eae aces 5 HNO Fe1 O03 eee leerere See 5 | 10.100 Queens, SSPE ie ak et anteiioseceen an oeen 2, 3,900 1 800 al 4,300 ---- OO dic Goro aaa ee eee ] | > 00 1 800 35 | $645,900 || 13 | $112,100 |; 48 - $758,000 Official Numbers and Tonnage. The bureau of navigation, E. C. O'Brien commissioner, assigned official numbers to the following lake vessels during the week ending Saturday, Dec. 10: Steam--Ann Arbor No. 2, Toledo, tonnage gross 1144.91, net 572.46, No. 106,984; Mollie L., Grand Haven, tonnage gross 22 92, net 18.16, No. 92,483. A house boat which is being built on Friendly island by E. W. Dewey of New York, is attracting considerable attention. It is to be 75 feet over all with 185 feet beam. It will have six fine rooms, with all home comforts, a parlorgl4 by 15 feet, a drawing room 10 by 14 feet and a kitchen 6 by 14 feet. The boat will cost $6,000 and was designed by A. A. Leyere. '